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At this morning's hearing the application was amended substantially by the applicant - who was represented by my fellow councillor and serial blog commenter David Nettleton (right).
Instead of extending the closing time by 1hr 20mins the applicant requested an extension of just 30minutes on Sundays, Thursdays and weekends.
Instead of extending the closing time by 1hr 20mins the applicant requested an extension of just 30minutes on Sundays, Thursdays and weekends.
Despite this climb-down the application was still rejected by the sub-committee, who seemed to recognise my simple argument that:
1. There is inevitably outside noise and disturbance created when any pub closes
2. This is predominantly a residential area and the law upholds the rights of residents
3. Closure at 12.30 Fri/Sat would mean residents (woken at 5 by refuse collection) would have their opportunity of sleeping further reduced.
4. This constitutes a public nuisance under the 2003 Act
5. Therefore the sub-committee had no option but to reject the application.
14 comments:
Paul - I agree that your argument was simple. The revised closing times were accepted by the Suffolk Constabulary. I have advised Jan Rutherford to appeal.
A comment which should have appeared here can be found byclicking here
Well, if it gets you a free beer, go ahead, appeal. You tried to shut up Mr Harding , you had a disgraceful go at the lady about walking her dog, so we will remember you. If you want to be more of a pariah than you were yesterday,back the pub rather than the vast majority of the ward
We can all enjoy a pub,and they are only trying their best, but dont take the mickey David. The trouble with uppity residents is that we get terribly uppity sometimes. I dont think you realise just how annoyed 'Dads Army' is out there and how much offence you caused. Those old ladies and gents still vote, and if yesterdays sorry show (albeit won by Paul Farmer and co - and thanks for that Paul, you do a great job) is anything to go by, the rest of you will all lose your plastic politicians jobs. Now go and enjoy your free pint.
Paul - I will respond to Anon's thinly-veiled attack on this post rather than where it was placed, as I think it will be more informative to your readers.
Anon - never let a few facts change a firmly held opinion. I had a day off as a councillor and I was representing Jan Rutherford pro bono as a friend. It does, however, impact on my Declaration of Interests at any council meeting where the Queens Head is discussed (except PQT).
Generally, Bury St Edmunds town centre has a large number of residents compared to many other towns. Paul represents the south side and I represent the north side. We have a lot of issues in common, one of which is problems arising from close proximity to pubs, clubs and bars.
Statistically, the Churchgate Street area has a 78:22 split between residential and commercial properties. Churchgate Street itself is within the town centre retail area as designated in the Local Plan.
Some of the pubs in the ward I represent have a greater ratio of residential to commercial properties surrounding them than the Queens Head, yet we manage to co-exist together without too much friction.
Yesterday, I was particularly interested in the representation made by the resident who lives directly opposite the Queens Head and I hope to address some of his concerns over the coming weeks and months.
I live 100 yards/metres from the Old Cannon Brewery and 200 from Station Hill. My bedroom faces Cannon Street and there is only a small front garden between the house and the road. I usually have the side window open unless it's very cold.
Cannon Street is a popular walking route from the town centre to Station Hill and back. My sleep is often disturbed after going to bed at around 12, sometimes between 2 and 3, as people return from the clubs.
As they walk past on the way to Station Hill, I don't know which pub or bar they were in previously, or which club they have come from on the walk back.
My radio alarm is set for 06.30 every morning but I usually wake before then; this morning at 04.45. It's often a pair of magpies which sleep in one of the 4 trees in my side garden who wake me with their squarking noises. There is a milk delivery van which rattles along about then but as I am a customer, I don't mind.
My criticism of the residents yesterday is that they have adopted a 'Fortress Churchgate' policy, closing their hearts (and windows) to the army of mainly under 30's moving around the town centre late at night.
Their objections are the same every time, they just cross out 'Dog & Partridge' and write 'So Bar' or, yesterday, 'Queens Head'. I don't think it's a sustainable policy as it will eventually work against them.
As for Jan Rutherford, she took it ever so well and didn't respond to the taunts of one objector in particular. But she is like that in private conversation and has always behaved with dignity in the 15 years I have known her.
Anon - Thanks for your thanks. I'm not sure if you are same as anon on my other post, but you are (both) in danger of becoming too intemperate. I don't want to have to censor comments, but I will if it becomes necessary. Please keep cool!
Anon
I can sympathise, I was speaking with a resident in southgate street who have to listern to these "people" on their way home for some reason they are unable to speak in any other tone than " moblie shout" they lose wing mirrors, plants, christmas wreaths etc etc. Compared with the grid area this is quite diluted.
Maybe we should have a telephone number to call to registar our complaints, rather than calling the police. Just maybe some enterprizing councillor or even the licenced victuallars may take the oppitunity to listern and address the complaints.
Generally I am not in favour of self control but in a brewery town we should at least have control over alcohol control
Paul - the literary style employed by the two anonymous comments indicates that they are from the same person. This person is probably a resident of Whiting Street and lives somewhere near the Hide Bar and the Masons Arms.
Whoever it is, they don't like me very much, do they?
Sgt Henthorn, who leads our local Safer Neighbourhood Team, writes as follows:
"I have read with interest the blog re the Queens Head. As you know one of the issues that I had was lack of information. I am not advocating that the community ring us up with every single thing that happens, but what I would suggest is that people use the generic safer Neighbourhood Team E-mail address to pass information to us.
This doesn't mean that we will automatically act on it but it will give us a better understanding of what's going on and enable us to take early action - thus preventing a bigger problem.
Of course anyone without access to E-mail can still ring us on 01284 774100
The E-mail address is burycentral.snt@suffolk.pnn.police.uk"
It would be useful if the time of the incident was also notified. If it is towards 12.30 or later it is less likely to be patrons ex-QH and more likely to be from customers of one of the other 6 pubs or bars in the immediate area, all of who have later permitted closing times.
Even such information is inconclusive as I illustrated in my earlier comment by my own example. I don't know where the people who pass my house at night have been, or are going. If only one would phone a friend and shout loudly 'I've just been drinking in X and I'm on my way to Y' I would be a dream witness. Sadly, it has never happened to me.
Of course, I could make it up - but I'd rather not. That would be unfair, which is where I think we started a few weeks ago.
I'm quite a new reader to this blog, and i wasn't present at the hearing referred to - so apologies in advance for any areas where those two facts might misguide me.
However, I'd like to make an observation on this issue. I don't live near to the pub in question, but i have given up town centre living (and the benefits that brings) largely because of the noise and anti-social behaviour issues, and i really object to David's implication that this is a matter of older people vs younger ("My criticism of the residents yesterday is that they have adopted a 'Fortress Churchgate' policy, closing their hearts (and windows) to the army of mainly under 30's moving around the town centre late at night").
I'm only just over 30, but i totally identify with the residents on this one. It's not only older people who dislike noise and disruption, and who need sleep - personally i need a good night's sleep for my mental health, and to be able to hold down a demanding job. Residents' right to that must be protected - nobody's life was ever severely impacted by not being able to spend an extra hour in the pub, but it easily can be by ongoing lack of sleep.
Yes, those in the town centre would have been aware that their choice of location brought with it some degree of noise, but they couldn't have predicted the change in licensing laws - and why should they have to move (even supposing they can afford to, with stamp duty etc) in order to maintain their quality of life?
If somebody's behaviour has to change to resolve this situation, wouldn't it be nice if it was that of those of my generation who seem to have no consideration whatever for others. If they didn't find it necessary to screech and hoot like chimps on their way down the street, there wouldn't be a problem in the first place!
Kate - what a breath of fresh air you have brought to this issue! Come back again and do visit my other blog. David will no doubt respond volubly (?)
I didn't make any remarks about the age of the objectors, simply because I don't know what that might be. I'm 63 myself, so unlikely to condemn 'older people' in general.
I'm also a town centre resident and have been since 1992. My sleep is often disturbed - especially on a Friday or Saturday night - by noisy people passing my bedroom window. From observation, rather than theory, I know that most of these nuisances are under 30. It's a fact.
The Licensing Act 2003, which came into force in 2005, is in its infancy. HMG has, I understand, asked for review. Good. I hope that the outcome is the abolition of closing times. This will lead to less criminal and anti-social behaviour on our streets late at night.
When Paul Farmer and the Churchgate Area Association grasp this concept we can all start to move forward.
I'm not holding my breath, though!
David
when did the St Edmunds head area become town centre?
sorry for the new comers cannon street brewery
BB - I do remember the St Edmunds Head but many just know it by its revitalised name of the Old Cannon Brewery.
Most of the Brackland area is within the Historic Core Zone and much within the Town Centre Conservation Area. My property is in both.
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